J2's at Junior Olympics

[Patrick Casey]

Is JO's becomming unwieldy? Do the J2 fields represent a talent ID that is accurate compared to how they fare as J1's or JO's? Is JO's a financial burden for these young kids? Is there too much emphasis on the National Level too early?
The Alpine kids don't meet up on the national scale until they are J1's. Should we do a regional (AK=West) (Central=East) J2 Championships?

[jcork]

I think that a J2, maybe J3 regional championship might be something to pursue. It's early so I'll break my thoughts down bullet-style ...

PLUS:
+ Might be less expensive
+ Might allow more J2/3s to attend, which might encourage more kids to stay in the sport
+ Would allow the younger, less mature J2s to experience a larger event without as much stress/conflict (i.e. currently, you often have eighth graders on a trip with college sophomores)
+ Could make for a smaller event -- easier for race organizers
+ Could provide developing coaches an opportunity to work a large event (RMN is bringing several coaches to Anchorage for development, but a more low-key event might satisfy this)

MINUS:
+ Need to come up with staffs/wax kits/test fleets for two championships
+ The best J2s in the country might not race each other for a long time
+ Need three different venues/organizing committees to step up every year
+ Every region would have to organize travel/housing/etc. for two trips -- that's a lot of time and energy

I know SVSEF has brought J2 teams out to the NENSA J2 championships before -- and the fact that such an event exists tells me that there is some demand.

[HannahSan*]

Not sure if this helps.. but i was J2 last year and yeah i didn't do that great, but i think it really helped me see what i had to accomplish before the next year. Yeah J2s are kinda young with a group of way older kids, but from my experience it really opened my eyes on how serious some kids were and how many there were that are doing what i am...it really helped me make my goals for my J1 years..which really count.

[jcork]

That's a pretty valid point.

[Eli Brown]

I like the idea of having west, central, and eastern J2 championships and having JOs be just for J1, OJ. More regionalism, more involvement at younger age. we are growing and should take some ideas from alpine.

[Andrew Gardner]

Agreed. We need to see more "Super Qualifiers" like you have at Soldier Hollow every year. That is a fantastic event.

[Patrick Casey]

Thanks Hannah!
I had a similar experience as a J2 when I went to JO's for the first time... It was good for me to be challenged at that age.

[Alex Schulz]

I agree as well. I know that when I was a J2 and made JOs it really helped motivate me to train harder and ski faster. It helped me a lot to see where I stacked up with the rest of the country so that I could try to improve. At some point we are all going to be racing each other, and I don't think J2 is too early. I think it helps too for the younger kids to be able to be a part of the team with the older kids, it is great for learning.

[Adam Terko]

I really agree that exposure to a higher level of racing is key. I also like seeing more of a age-level neutrality going on. The best example I can think of are the NENSA rollerski races this summer-It was pretty cool to be in a mass start with other high school kids, master skiers, college skiers and andrew johnson. Thats a pretty diverse group, and when you see what you're going to be up against in the future, it can be really motivational, not to mention informative.

[Janice Sibilia]

Maybe it could be looked at from more of an individual approach? A coach will generally know if a J2 is ready for something like JO's, regardless if they have qualified. Its an experience that can really fire up a skier. If they are not ready, for sure it can have the opposite affect, but it seems much more common that it's a positive experience. Other options for the kids that may not be ready just yet, are crucial for development.
New England hosts a J2 Championship event and an Eastern High School Championship each year and many skiers see this as a stepping stone to JO's. They are very well attended, fiercely competitive and even have some out of region ( western and a team from Russia), participating.
Having this happen in other regions with a culmination event of sorts, would be awesome- the focus could then really be put on appropriate courses, formats, etc for this age group.

[Ja Dorris]

I think this is a great discussion and I am totally open to any points of view. Frankly, I do not have strong feelings one way or another at this time. I do think this discussion needs to be looked at from all points of view. Many of you have made some great points. It was not too long ago that it was tough to even get a venue to put in a bid for JO's, now we are considering bids years out, and sometimes competing bids from the same region. It seems to me that the event has some pretty significant financial gains that can be made for a particular club or ski area, not to mention the economic considerations that can impact a community. I do think that JO's has probably reached a critical mass, but that critical mass has provided the financial support for communities to want to host the event. I certainly believe that we need to look at ways to keep younger skiers involved in racing, I believe that is what is driving this discussion. Each region is going to have unique situations that will apply to them.

[Jeff Reed]

I like Eli's idea. In some respects, I see New England and Midwest already doing this - J2 Championships in NE and the Junior Birkie/J3/4 Championships in the Midwest. The venues might even be in place to eleviate the need for more organizing committees etc. (i.e. Jr Birkie). The more regional approach also allows for more skiers to participate and would possibly enable even younger skiers (J3/4) to get involved more. jcork also make a great point about getting more coaches involved with events like this - that development gets overlooked. Exciting stuff!

[Gus Johnson]

I am all for a separate J2 championship, although for more personal reasons. I got into racing & training a little late. My first serious race was when I was a second year J1. Getting into racing late, I just wasn't going to be competitive with the guys who had been serious from an early age until I had a couple years of expirience under my belt. I've worked hard and now as an OJ, I am proud to say that I can race with guys I couldn't have a couple years ago.

A separate J2 championship might free up some spots for more J1/OJs to compete at junior olympics. I have heard some buzz about it in the intermountain region. The IMD has 21 spots granted by the USSA for each gender (not including prequalified athletes) to send to JOs. 9 spots go to J2s and 12 go to J1/OJs. Intermountain is becoming a very strong division (won the alaska cup last year pretty handily) and the line between who is qualified to ski at JOs and who is not is becoming blurred because there are more than 12 J1/OJs who are racing fast enough to be competitive with guys from other regions. A lot of the J1/OJs are looking to JOs as a place where they can take their results to a college coach for recruiting and say, "this is a pretty accurate description of my fitness and potential against the country's top juniors". I don't want to see a J1/OJ with potential leave the sport because they weren't able to show what they were made of to someone else with concrete results from Junior Olympics. I don't think that JOs for J2s is as important for the furthering of their ski careers as it is for the J1/OJs This may just be an Intermountain Divisional issue but I think it may be happening all over the country as well.

I know first-hand that training smart and serious from an early age makes success easier later on because I have been playing catch-up for a couple of years. Justin Freeman never went to Junior Nationals, and I am not aledging that he was blocked out by a lack spots that were taken by J2s, but I wonder how many skiers with potential are never going to get the "Junior National Expirience" because the competition is tighter and the spots available remain the same. As the sport grows more competitive, so should the availability to show how competitive you are.